S01-E03 Peter - Kurt J. Lesker

In this episode, you’ll meet Peter from Kurt J. Lesker. Peter shares his journey from Sweden to the U.S., where he began working in a vacuum company and eventually became an assembly supervisor. Peter outlines the general steps for troubleshooting vacuum systems: defining the problem, collecting data, analyzing it, and working on solutions. Peter emphasizes the importance of cleanliness and precision, especially during the build process. He discusses common issues like failing to reach base pressure, the role of seals and pumps, and the use of helium leak detectors. Peter advises technicians to keep good track of the data they collect for service calls and stresses the importance of due diligence in maintaining vacuum systems.

Links from the show:

SUNY Erie Vacuum Technology Program: https://www.suny.edu/microcredentials/programs/1000001001/

Normandale Community College Vacuum and Thin Film Technology (AAS) Degree Program: https://normandale.smartcatalogiq.com/en/2025-2026/course-catalog/programs-of-study/vacuum-and-thin-film-technology-aas/

Intro Music: District Zero by Raz Burg provided by Artlist, License Number - 2h3htV 

Transcript

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Peter Kazarinoff  0:00  

From the Technicians in Vacuum Technologies project, this is Troubleshooting Technicians. A podcast about technicians working in the vacuum industry: the work they do, and how they troubleshoot. I'm your host, Peter Kazarinoff. I teach technicians and engineers at Portland Community College. In this episode, you'll meet Peter. Peter works at the Kurt J. Lesker Company, which supplies vacuum components and service to the vacuum industry. So Peter, welcome to the podcast. Can you tell me a little bit about your background? How did you get involved in working in a vacuum, and what do you do now?

Peter  0:47  

Thank you, Peter. Yes. So my name is Peter Calebsson. I moved to Pittsburgh in the United States from Sweden about 20 years ago, and one of the first jobs I applied to and got was actually a vacuum company, which is where I'm still working today, and I started there in the warehouse, and I really, really got interested in the tech around vacuum. It was really eye opening to see all these avenues that are improving through vacuum systems and all the research that's being done, anything from space research to energy research, to medical research, and I knew right away that I wanted more of this, so I worked hard, did my homework and applied for a job with assembly, and I was an assembly technician for about 10 years. Got a couple of big special projects for customers. I can't, you know, NDAs in place. I can't mention we did really good, executed well, with me and my team on those projects, and then they had no choice but to make me an assembly supervisor. And that's the capacity I've held in the last six years. I believe so so 18 years with the Curt Gillespie company as as a vacuum expert, and still enjoying every day of it.

Peter Kazarinoff  2:06  

So there's sort of like this general set of steps Peter when we're doing troubleshooting, and in particular, troubleshooting with vacuum system. So just like real quick, so we can orient everybody. What are these general set of steps that would use for troubleshooting, and then we'll talk about a specific scenario after that.

Peter  2:27  

Right? You need to define the problem, of course. You need to collect the data to support your definition of the problem. You need to analyze that data, and then you have to work on your solution. What makes vacuum system a little different is just the level of cleanliness and precision that you need to apply for these various things. I would say it's more important in the Build step than in the troubleshooting step when it comes to vacuum system, because any kind of mishaps during the build will definitely cause a lot of troubleshooting time on for the end user,

Peter Kazarinoff  3:05  

Right, right. So we have that general set of steps, and then, as you said, Peter, we have to keep those things in mind that vacuum troubleshooting can be different than other types, but there are a lot of similarities too. So in order to sort of dig into, like a sample set of using these steps into doing troubleshooting. Could you describe, for me, like a fairly simple vacuum system that a technician might use, and then after that, we can talk about maybe a problem that a technician notes in that vacuum system?

Peter  3:36  

Sure. So a very, very common one for any kind of vacuum system is, of course, that you can't reach base pressure. What that base pressure is depends on the customer and your specifications that you're trying to meet. But what makes that one a difficult one, even though it's a very common one, is that that leak to find the origin of that leak, that's where you're going to spend your time looking for it and then fixing the problem, right?

Peter Kazarinoff  4:01  

So our problem is we can't pump down to this low base pressure. And besides the chamber that that base pressure is going to be measured in, what could be other components in this simple vacuum system that we're imagining to troubleshoot?

Peter  4:16  

So it could be the gaging itself. You'll probably have an array of convection gages and wide range gages to measure your vacuum, you are going to have, naturally, some sort of some sort of seal somewhere, be it copper gaskets, you know, conflag configuration, or O ring seals. And out of those two culprits, the O ring seal is probably the bigger villain in this, because it's an O ring, it's rubber. So somewhere there probably lays your problem.

Peter Kazarinoff  4:49  

And then what about the other components? Might there be pumps, or different types of pumps to get to this real low vacuum level?

Peter  4:56  

Sure. Yeah. So you will, you will usually have, well, you will. Always have a roughing pump. That's the workhorse, right? And it they are very robust. A pump will will pump. It's what they're designed to do. But then, if you are talking about getting down to the higher vacuum levels for for certain processes, you're also going to have either a cryopump or a turbo pump to back your roughing pump up, and they are a lot more technically advanced and more expensive, of course, right?

Peter Kazarinoff  5:28  

So, Peter, we've got this model vacuum system. We've got a chamber that's got to pump down to some sort of high vacuum level. We might have some gages connected to it. We might have some seals, and then probably at least one, but maybe two pumps sort of connected to it. And you said, like, yeah, we've got this troubleshooting problem. The chamber is not pumping down to the vacuum level. That's at specification. So what would the technician do? Like, first, what would be their first step to sort of go about solving this problem?

Peter  6:02  

So the first thing would be to look for all the obvious solutions. So you're going to open up your anything that you can open, like if you have a loading door or a load lock or something like that, you're going to open your doors, and you're going to give it a visual inspection for any kind of lint or fuzz. I mean, a lot of times these vacuum systems are in clean room rated NanoFab, and it's usually not an issue, but it's still worth doing, because if you find a solution right there, then we're talking about a five minute fix, rather than a several hours fix.

Peter Kazarinoff  6:36  

And then sort of, what should that technician compare to? So they've like collected this data like we're not getting pumped down. But what might you need to then compare it to to know about your solution working or not

Peter  6:53  

So well - It depends a little bit on your vacuum chamber. But if you have purchased this vacuum chamber from a from a vendor such as ourselves, they would have supplied you with a spec that they have met. So you have a number that you know that this chamber is capable of reaching. So anything less than that number, you have some kind of issue going on.

Peter Kazarinoff  7:15  

Right, right. So we've got this previous log, possibly about where the chamber has been pumped to, or maybe a specification from the manufacturer about what it should be pumped to, but currently it isn't. So, yeah, let's, let's imagine we've got our technician, and what they're looking for is the seals. And they zero in, like, on those O rings, because those could, like, be culprits. But then they go through the pump, down cycle again, and it doesn't work. It's still not pumping low enough. So sort of what would what would you do next if our initial solution, our initial troubleshooting solution, isn't working?

Peter  7:55  

Okay -  So now we've ruled out the simple things that we could just do on ourselves in a relatively small timeframe. So now it's time to dig a little deeper. So at this point, either if you have access to one, or if you can even rent one for this occasion, it is time to hook it up to a leak detector, a helium style leak detector, and actually let that one help you to localize this leak

Peter Kazarinoff  8:21  

Right, so now it's sort of, in a way, we might be bringing in the bigger equipment, or the more expensive equipment, or the more time consuming equipment, to try to track down where that leak is. So Peter, I've got an idea of kind of the steps and what the system might look at. But one thing technicians come against is just time, either the time in their shift or the time during the week to fix this or production needs to start, like right away. And the other thing is resources, like, can we rent the helium leak detector, for instance? Or do we have one on site already, or could we buy so how long should generally you think technicians should be working in a problem before they're calling in, like those bigger resources, and what are other examples of resources or places that they can go for help with troubleshooting.

Peter  9:22  

Sure. So it all depends on on your setup and and your set of circumstances, right? So among our customers, we have production customers, and then we also have a lot of a lot of our systems get used in research, in universities all over the globe, and you tend to have a little more time on your hands, on a university to fix these problems, rather than if your whole production system is down. So that will actually take you down the path of what urgency This is needed. Most companies in the vacuum industry also offers phone support, so if you can't fix it within a. An hour, I would recommend reaching out for the phone or, you know, some version of teams, or, you know, online help. There might be things there that we can simple steps, that we can talk through and and solve without, you know, bringing in the big guns,

Peter Kazarinoff  10:19  

Right, right - So Peter, definitely one of those resources would be the manufacturers of the equipment, and then being able to reach out to them. So that brings up another sort of good topic, which is what sort of like data reporting is useful for those technicians to be able to collect and have with them when they make one of these service calls or reach out to get help. What kind of things is it useful for those technicians to have on hand when they make that call?

Peter  10:50  

Sure. So any data is good data, really, at the very minimum, some screenshots of where your pressure is at right now versus what you're used to seeing, a little description of the steps you've already taken, but also things like, if you already have RGA residual gas analyzer hooked up to your system, you could certainly also provide that, because certain things like, if you have water in your system, you're never really going to get good vacuum, and your RGA would actually be able to supply that and say that you have, you know, H, 2o molecules in your chamber. So any data you had will certainly be, should be provided so it can be investigated.

Peter Kazarinoff  11:33  

Right, right. And I also imagine it might be useful just to know what kind of system that they're working with, what chamber Do you have, what seals are in line? Which gage types do you have, what pump models, things like that as well, for sure. So Peter, kind of to finish up for today, I wanted to ask you, based on your years of working in vacuum and working with many different vacuum components, what are some typical things that will cause problems in a vacuum system?

Peter  12:02  

Like I mentioned earlier, very early in the interview. A lot of times, if your vacuum fails early on your first startup, I would say that it might be something there that's not assembled correctly. It could be that an O ring or a gasket is flipped the wrong way. It could be that some of those conflict flanges aren't tightened down all the way that kind of stuff. So we're definitely looking for loose bolts and dirty O rings. But if it happens later in your process that your system, you've had it for several months, even years, and it's starting to develop, it's almost always deposition build up and things like that. So it's not a bad idea to even from day one to talk about some kind of service plan on how to keep your vacuum system happy and clean and functioning for a very long time, because these vacuum systems are not cheap, so obviously you want to get the most amount of work and effort out of it.

Peter Kazarinoff  12:56  

So right. So Peter, something which has come up a couple of times during our conversation that I did want to dig into a little more is just cleanliness, because you've mentioned that a couple times. Why is it so important for technicians to maintain maintain cleanliness around and within their vacuum systems?

Peter  13:14  

So our vacuum systems are typically used for thin film deposition, meaning you want to put a molecule thin layer of something on top of another, another sample or substrate. And when we're talking layers down into the microns, then something like, like a human hair or a little bit of dust is gigantic. You know, it will definitely show up big if you have a hair across an O ring seal somewhere, you're never going to be able to pump down to a good vacuum, cleanliness is the key aspect of anything vacuum related

Peter Kazarinoff  13:45  

Right. right - yeah. So we talked a little about reporting, data collection, and then it seems like another one of these keys is just making sure you maintain that cleanliness and sort of maintain their order. So Peter, just to finish up, is there anything based on your years of working in the vacuum industry that we didn't talk about, but you think is important for technicians to know?

Peter  14:09  

Well, you caught me out there a little bit. Now, just Yes, due diligence, you know, pay attention to all the little details, even if you're coming from another industry and is joining the vacuum industry from that a bolt is a bolt and a nut is a nut, you know. But just be very, very diligent in things like torque specs and tight down, tightening down patterns and things like that. Because these things, these vacuum chambers, they're playing an important part in changing our lives for the better every day within healthcare, tech, fusion reactors, energy, solar panels. Treat them with with the respect they're due, and they will treat you well.

Peter Kazarinoff  14:48  

Well. Peter, thank you so much for talking with me today about vacuum systems and troubleshooting.

Peter  14:53  

My pleasure. Peter, thank you very much.

Peter Kazarinoff  14:56  

Please keep in touch. 

Troubleshooting Technicians is produced by the Developing and Using Resources and Strategies to Educate Technicians in Vacuum Technologies project through financial support from the National Science Foundation's Advanced Technological Education grant program, DUE ATE number 2400426. Opinions expressed on this podcast do not necessarily represent those of the National Science Foundation.